Connecting a midi theatre organ

You need one or moreMIDI keyboards to really play the Miditzer
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Rodgers Theatre
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Post by Rodgers Theatre » Thu Mar 27, 2008 1:13 am

Hi everyone, this is my first post here.  I have to admit, i am absolutely amazed by this miditzer site and what it can do.    I have a Rodgers olympic 333 theatre organ equipped with midi on all three manuals and the bass pedals.  I do have organ samples running through a sound module, but these ones sound so clear and true to life.   How easy would it be for me to rig up my organ to my computer to get all manuals working and what systems are recommended for changing the sounds.  I have 14 thumb pistons that are midi active so would it be fairly easy for me to get these working and will the miditzer system allow 14 presets.
 
Sorry about the long first post but i am very excited to see if any of this is possible.
 
Kind regards,
 
Chris

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Post by engrssc » Thu Mar 27, 2008 1:37 am

Hi Chris and welcome,
 
You will need to be able to connect the MIDI output of the organ to your computer, of course. Many of us use a MIDI to USB interface such as MidiSport made by M-Audio. These come in various configurations such as 2 X 2, 4 X 4 and 8 X 8. They also make a simple cable referred to as UNO (one). This one is to be avoided. Turtle Beach also has some interfaces that others have used. Another option in place of using USB, is to connect the MIDI Out of the organ to a MIDI In of certain sound cards that have such a MIDI connection.
 
In thinking about this, consider MidiTzer as the organ's relay or control system. The interaction to the computer is done via MIDI messages. 
 
Assume your Rodgers has a single MIDI Out connector? Once you get the organ MIDI interfaced to the computer, there is a free downloadable program www.midiox.com that is very useful in determining the settings to be set in MidiTzer to receive the MIDI information from the organ.
 
Another "function" will be to connect the audio out of the computer to an amplifier/speaker which could be already built into the organ. (Most Rodgers do have this feature and you may already be using that for your sound module).
 
Once you determine the MIDI information "sent" by the Rodgers, MidiTzer can be set up quite easily. There is a section referred to as Base Camp which will guide you thru these steps.
 
The pistons also can be used to operate MidiTzer's combination action which of course is very useful. Many of us use touch screens as a simple method to hand register.
 
Since you already have a MIDI-fyed console, the integration to using MidiTzer should be very possible. In my case, I had to Midi-fy a Rodgers 340 which is an analogue instrument. Rodgers 340 Makeover might give you some ideas.
 
You probably are aware that there is a 3 manual version of MidiTzer known as the 260 SP. While the 2 manual 216 is a free download, the 260 requires a contribution of $100 which is used toward preservation and the rebulding of a real Theatre Pipe organ. BTW, the 260 is well worth that contribution.
 
Hope that gives you some starter info. There are many folks on this Forum that will be glad to help guide you along the way.
 
 
 
Rgds,
Edengrssc2008-03-27 02:43:24

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Post by Rodgers Theatre » Thu Mar 27, 2008 1:56 am

Hi Ed.  Many thanks for your prompt reply.   I was looking at the pictures of your set up earlier.  Looks absolutely amazing.  You must be the envy of many people on here.  I do already have amps, speakers, reverb and sub bass speakers connected to my set up.  My organ doesn't have integral speakers.  It does have one midi output for all the channels and pistons and is using an intermidi, midi system.  I am using the 60 day trial of the 3 manual miditzer system and evn after 10 minutes on it i know i will be giving the 100 dollars for the system.   One other question i have is as follows...    is there any way i can get just the sample sounds from the miditzer to use with my roland fantom xr sound module...   the roland module uses a compact flash memory card which i currently have sound samples on, so i am wondering if the samples are available to add to a compact flash sound card to use on my current system...  
 
Many thanks,
 
Chris

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Post by engrssc » Thu Mar 27, 2008 2:22 am

Hi again,
 
Basically, the native MidiTzer organs are, as I said, "perform" the relay function of a TPO. They use/drive soundfonts as "their" means of creating the sounds/ranks we hear. By the same token, these soundfonts can be interchanged with various other (than supplied) soundfonts. (You may later want to consider exploring all the many and varied soundfonts to use as well). I may stand to be corrected by Jim and/or others, but in my experience, most sound module systems have "exclusive" and sometimes propriatory sound generating systems. There is a page here:   John Tay - Wurlitzer Samples that refers to the samples created by John Tay that are used in the MidiTzer.
 
That said, many of us have "customized" our organ "ranks" by substituting various other ranks. As to making these available to add to your Roland Fantom, maybe someone else may have to jump in as I haven't, myself, done that.
 
Rgds,
Edengrssc2008-03-27 03:29:00

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Post by Rodgers Theatre » Thu Mar 27, 2008 2:39 am

Many thanks for your input on this Ed.  I might just start trying to use and configure the miditzer system to my rodgers organ instead of my current set up.  I love the idea of a touch screen to be able to change the sounds, as i can only change the sounds with my thumb and toe pistons on the roland.  It would be nice to be able to pick out individual tabs for sounds instead of just groups of sounds.  Many thanks once again for your time in replying to my posts and look forward to speaking with you in the near future.
 
Chris

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Post by engrssc » Thu Mar 27, 2008 2:45 am

A suggestion - start with a plan and follow it (more or less). You will find that there is a huge amount of options in this virtual world, each having some merit. But, if you start pursuing too many, your main objective might get lost in the shuffle. Even as we communicate this, there are improvements happening, which makes these project all the more exciting. Once you get something going and gain some experience, we can chat about even more "good stuff".
Rgds again,
Ed

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Re: Connecting a midi theatre organ

Post by StentorVox » Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:30 am

Chris,

The beauty of the MidiTzer is that it functions as a completely separate organ from a MIDI organ.
"The single MIDI OUT signal from the organ, plugs into the computer, and the keyboard INPUTS are configured in the "settings" screen of the software - that little yellow "M."

I have never sought to configure the buttons of the MIDI console to replicate MidITzer, although some have devoted a lot of time to attempt that.

In my case, using an existing classical MIDI console, it is easy to simply add theatre organ to play concomitantly from the same keyboards, using touchscreen to engage theatre organ as well as the classic stops on their own.

Although I COULD loop the computer MIDI OUT back thru the aux/line input of the Baldwin Classic organ for speakers setup, I prefer to energize a rack of amps to run separate speakers direct from the computer soundcards, placing them separately from the classic organ speakers. Engaging the MIDI stoptabs of the classical organ console enables me to bring into play the entire MidiTzer using touchscreen commands.

Since my classic console only has two manuals, I have added a third MIDI keyboard to the stack, and run its MIDI-OUT signal to a second soundcard MIDI-IN of the computer. I configure it in the MidiTzer INPUT settings as the solo manual of the 260, whereas the other MIDI OUT of the classical console is plugged into the other soundcard, configured in "settings / inputs" to become the lower two manuals, the pedals and the AUX commands.

(truth is I also use an additional MIDI keyboard in this stack, the fourth keyboard plugged into a completely separate organ engine (Roland Sound Canvas and Wersi brain), plus creating a MIDI-powered 4 rank WurliTzer winded chest of actual pipes to augment my installation.

So you see, one console of four manuals plays the intended two manuals of classical organ plus a three manual 260 MidiTzer and the fourth topmost keyboard plays an entire separate MIDI organ - all from the same console. I intend to reverse the ivory/ebony colors of the topmost keyboard just for the heck of it (as Billy Joel did on his custom Allen), since that is a completely different set of organs.

In addition, I have a couple of other major installations, but this is how I use an existing MIDI organ console to run the software we speak on this chatlist forum. I have never found it necessary to attempt to operate the MidiTzer from actual controls of the existing MIDI organ, when I can simply control all of that from a separate touchscreen.

Although my touring 216 console design (documented on my outdated website) features stoptabs and pistons replicating the design of the original local theatre 216 instrument operates from MIDI triggering (using DIY MidiBox technology) - it is not otherwise a MIDI organ.

I feel closer to the organ concept promulgated by Hope-Jones who sought to add symphonic sounds to his original church organ at St. Johns as a complete unit orchestra playable from a single console by one person. It would have thrilled him to see the development of MidiTzer in his day. In my installation I have the complete panoply of classic and symphonic ranks playable together.

PK

P.S.
It's been awhile since you posted (sometimes it's difficult to pick and choose to navigate the forum) but I wonder what was the outcome of your project.

rmac
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Re: Connecting a midi theatre organ

Post by rmac » Sat Oct 07, 2017 11:01 am

PK (StentorVox)

By clicking on someones name you can bring up when they joined and the last time they looked at the site. In Chris (Rodgers Theatre)'s case he was last on 12/27/09. My experience is with that length of time a person has lost interest in Miditzer. Using this feature will help you determine whether or not to ask someone a question.

Bob The Virtual Organist.

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